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Moving to Hawaii Regret
04-10-2014, 01:13 AM
Post: #1
Sad Moving to Hawaii Regret
Hello,

I moved to Hawaii about a month and a half ago. I absolutely love warm water, warm weather, and the tropics in general. However, I have found living on Oahu to be an absolute nightmare. I mean, I hate it it. I never thought I would say that. If you are thinking of moving here, consider this:

1. Hawaiians will hate you for being an evil mainlander. Be expected to have people be EXTREMELY rude to you everytime you try to register your car, find an apartment, etc.

2. People in Hawaii are happy right? Wrong. Expect people at your job (and even the grocery store) to be angry and for there to be full out screaming fights at whatever job you get.

3. Your options will be to either a) have a cockroach infested house, b) have no hot water, and/or c) have an apartment so loud you can't sleep at night. All for $1,500 a month for rent. Yay!

4. You know it is expensive right? Wrong. It is much more expensive than you think.

In conclusion, do not move here. It is awful. Yes, the scenery is beautiful but the people are mean and it is not worth it. I wish I could go back in time and not move here.
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04-10-2014, 01:24 AM (This post was last modified: 04-10-2014 01:24 AM by eleakai.)
Post: #2
RE: Moving to Hawaii Regret
Aloha and welcome to our forum. It's always good to hear from people who share their moving stories. Where did you live before moving to Hawaii? True, Hawaii is not for everybody (even though many people think it's paradise). But as you mentioned, there are disadvantages as well. Hopefully things work out for you.
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04-20-2014, 03:47 PM
Post: #3
RE: Moving to Hawaii Regret
(04-10-2014 01:13 AM)et123 Wrote:  In conclusion, do not move here. It is awful. Yes, the scenery is beautiful but the people are mean and it is not worth it. I wish I could go back in time and not move here.

*********************************************************

Good lord, I hope that your experience is a rarity as we've been making our moves to move there, to Oahu, in a year or so. I was born there (though I'm not Hawaiian),but never had a chance to live there as shortly after my birth my parents moved us to the mainland where they were from.

I grew up in the PacNorthwest, around the Seattle region (loved it there until the early/mid-80s influx), but have lived for the last twenty-six years in a little remote college burg in the South Western section of Washington for education/work reasons and desperately need to get out of this region and into a whole other kind of environment, both geographically and socially, before I get much older (I'm 54 now) and have always wanted to live in Hawaii since I was a little kid and would see the old family films and photos.

I've been researching Hawaii and Oahu for some years and do get jittery as not ever having been there I read some stories such as yours and from some native folks and think, wow, sounds almost like South Central L.A. But then I read other peoples' experiences and think, maybe those first folks are just overreacting or, if native, just trying to keep people from moving there. And so far, I've yet to be able to decide what the real experience is and would be.

After reading your post earlier today we discussed it and it just seems to reaffirm our idea of leaving everything in storage somewhere on the mainland and going over, with the idea of permanently staying, with just a backpack-sized situation and give it our best go and if after, say, two, three years things don't workout, then we could just pack our packs and skedaddle and not have to ship our stuff back with the attendant cost.

Despite my university connections and quite a few Islanders going to school here, really, they haven't been able to offer a true picture of what it would be like for a non-Hawaiian to move there. And even though my having been born there supposedly gives some degree of cache known as being a "local", as I've read and been told, I suspect that won't hold much water for Hawaiians.

But the fact is, the islands have been calling me since I could first remember. And over all the years of my life I've always felt something's missing, that being the I am NOT where I was born and need to live. I've always loved warm weather, tropical climes and being outdoors. And that's what I want for life in Hawaii.

I'm really bummed for you that you're having such an awful experience there. I hope it will somehow get better for you and the happiness you sought there will come to be. Best wishes.

I'd sure like to hear from others on here about their experiences moving to Hawaii from the mainland.
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04-21-2014, 10:11 AM (This post was last modified: 04-21-2014 10:23 AM by tminker.)
Post: #4
RE: Moving to Hawaii Regret
Thinking about my comments over night it occurred to me to add that I have immense respect for nativist sentiments regarding the unceasing despoilation of their homelands by outsiders that started centuries ago and sees no end in sight still. I appreciate, in such contained environs as the Islands are, that there's little to no room in many people's minds for a "live and let live" view as they see the Islands being bought up by private multi-national corporate entities, etc, and the other Islands being overrun by those who have zero interest in the Hawaiian people, their history and trying to retain some of that for all of Hawaii. So I can appreciate islanders', particularly Hawaiians', frustration and anger towards many people. But I would hope that the legendary "Aloha Spirit" is a real thing and that Islanders can differentiate between those who dismiss Hawaiians and Hawaii as a world all its own, and those who embrace and want to somehow become a part of being an Islander and the Aloha Spirit.

Ever since I could remember I've always thought of myself as an earthling, a mere human, long before I would think of myself as caucasian, "white", or as an American. Never had much truck with borders, which is my mind going back to my own ancient tribal roots deep inside. As I said before, I was born on Oahu and have always felt "The Call Of The Islands" in my bones, in my soul. So there must be something of the Islander in me.

So, deep down, as well as overtly consciously, I've always thought of myself as a part of the Tribe of Mankind, of all Earth. Not as "white" or American. Just a human being among all the planet's other human beings. I'm more about the spiritual (as opposed to religious) by a long shot than I am about modern society, especially the profit-before-all-else corporate society that's slowly but surely destroying everything across the globe for no other reason than for profit and enriching a few.

I truly love tropical climes, having spent just a few of my first years after leaving Hawaii as a toddler, in San Diego, and later enjoying the islands of the Puget Sound where my family had a cabin and we'd spend the whole of the Summer up there fishing, clamming, crabbing and just enjoying the salty water and breezes.

I have no illusions that Hawaii is a perfect paradise free from problems. But I sure hope that some real degree of the Aloha Spirit is dominant there, rather than the ugly side of humanity one can find everywhere these days. And, from our research, and living in a college town where everyone's a captive consumer, slaves to the business folks who gouge us big time here in our little out of the way section of Washington state, why, our take is things are expensive everywhere these days with some things more so in one place than another and some things less than in others.

From our research rents in Hawaii are on par, or even better in some cases, than right here in little old Pullman. We've checked out food items and they are comparable to here with only a few items being a tad, a TAD, higher there than here. And in some cases a bit less there than here. But then we do mostly home cooking so our costs are always less than if one chows the store bought and store deli types of food, fast food and restaurant fare.

The one thing that is most definitely higher is gasoline. And given Oahu's small area and that public transport is easily available there we plan on NOT owning a vehicle as it doesn't seem to make sense in such close quarters as the Honolulu area. Our idea is that if once in a while we need a vehicle for, say, a day trip around the Island or to move then we can rent for a day. Otherwise, doesn't seem cost effective nor reasonable to have thousands and thousands of personal vehicles on such a small geographical site when public transport is easily available. But that's just us. We're way past being tired of the overall costs of owning a vehicle. They're just too expensive all around these days. Not worth the thousands of dollars per year.

As for employment, well, I echo "eleakai" in wondering where you moved FROM, as that could tell us a lot as to your expectations in Hawaii. Also, I would wonder what kind of work you sought and did get while in Hawaii. These questions aren't in any way negative attack types. Just simply that where one hails from and the type of employment one is seeking could have some play into your experiencing such a negative experience there. I mention this as I went down to the South last year for the first time in my life. Spent three months there, stayed in Baton rouge, La. and toured from eastern Texas all across to lower Florida and on up to the Carolinas and Tenneessee and couldn't get back to the PacNorthwest fast enough to escape a region I'd not want to go to again. I met a few nice folks there, mostly Asian and Indian (from India), but most of the whites and blacks were really standoffish, if not downright rude. I discovered they don't like each other much, but they really intensely dislike non-Southerners. Even most of the whites were that way to even white non-Southerners, though they'd try, but failed, to disguise it behind a fake veneer of that PR-concocted hokey cartoon all y'all "Southern Hospitality". The nicest, most down-to-earth people I met there were foreigners, mainly, as I said, from SE Asia or India.

I came away from the South with my impressions reaffirmed, rather than hopefully being put to rest. So you can see why I would wonder about where you moved from. Anyway, I do hope your experience does improve. And I do hope when I get over there that the Aloha Spirit is a real thing, not a fakey cartoony PR thing like the "Southern Hospitality" thing is.

I thought there was an "edit post" feature on here but I guess not. I'd wanted to edit a passage in my first post to add some of the things in my second post but discovered I cannot. Now I want to edit something in my 2nd one as well. Guess I'll have to settle for another addendum, to whit, this passage here:

"I truly love tropical climes, having spent just a few of my first years after leaving Hawaii as a toddler, in San Diego, and later enjoying the islands of the Puget Sound where my family had a cabin"

... could use a little clarification, not that anyone but myself cares. So, I've spent time in tropical-like climes, such as San Diego, Florida, and enjoyed island experiences as mentioned in the quote. I didn't mean that the islands of the Puget Sound where we had our cabin was tropical, just that they were islands and I enjoyed the island salt water/sea experiences immensely.

I post this just for myself to clarify a point lest someone think I was suggesting the islands of the Pacific Northwest were a tropical environment.
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04-22-2014, 06:21 AM
Post: #5
RE: Moving to Hawaii Regret
I moved to Oahu a little more than 10 years ago (from Europe) and I personally haven't come across any hostile Hawaiians or locals. But then I also have to add that I haven't personally met all too many. On Oahu, whenever I rented an apartment all my landlords so far have been Asian. My colleagues at all the companies I have worked at so far were mainly Asian or Caucasian and only two Hawaiians. The Hawaiians that I personally know are of mixed race (part Hawaiian, part Asian or White). They were born and raised in Hawaii, but are not 100% Hawaiian. I personally don't care about someone's race or skin color, but rather on maturity. I think whether someone is "friendly" or "mean" doesn't depend on race at all. I also think that it really depends in what circles one mingles and in what neighborhood one lives.
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04-22-2014, 07:15 AM
Post: #6
RE: Moving to Hawaii Regret
I really enjoyed reading your posts. You sure have made some interesting observations on your travels. I also think your plan sounds reasonable to move to Hawaii with as few belongings as possible and see how you like living here. I know quite a few people who moved to Hawaii and they love it and can't imagine ever leaving. Most local residents are not of Hawaiian ancestry, but are nevertheless Hawaiian at heart. I also think it's more important to appreciate, love and take care of the land.
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04-22-2014, 01:48 PM (This post was last modified: 04-22-2014 02:28 PM by tminker.)
Post: #7
RE: Moving to Hawaii Regret
(04-22-2014 06:21 AM)Joe808 Wrote:  I personally don't care about someone's race or skin color, but rather on maturity. I think whether someone is "friendly" or "mean" doesn't depend on race at all.

Oh, I totally agree. But the reality is, for many others on all sides, of all races and colors, those things do indeed matter and people of all backgrounds will and do use their own and others' backgrounds as tools, either for self-enrichment (exploitation) or as a weapon against others.

The reason I want to move to Hawaii is precisely because of diversity as where I live now it is politically, socially and culturally stultifying. I revel and embrace in diversity and peoples and cultures of all kinds. But I'm not so naive as to think just because I'm that way others (of all kinds) think the same. And there is, as can be found almost everywhere in the world, certain factions of certain peoples who are adamant against others for one reason or another, sometimes with some degree of legitimacy.

I've kept up on Hawaii, from afar, as best I can for over four decades so am very aware that some many folks in the Islands harbor some real frustrations and even animosity towards others not originally from there. And I respect many of the reasons for their sentiments.

The thing that makes an environment such as the Islands way different than on the mainland is the geographical size. On the mainland there's room to spread out and if there's problems one has the room to sidestep them for the most part, that is to say, avoid engaging those who cause the grief. The Islands, on the other hand, are small environments. And Oahu at roughly 44 miles long and 30 miles wide with a population of nearly a million, with another 7.6 million (as of last year, a record) coming through each year means a whole lot of people in a very small place. I can appreciate that at times many permanent folks might get short tempered at times (that happens in every locale everywhere to one degree or another), what with thousands and thousands of tourists there at any given time, many of whom have no vested interest in Honolulu, Oahu or the Islands overall except in treating it as their version of a tropical carnival and the people living there as mere props or servants. I'm sure that many of these non-residents exhibit a real degree of loutish, boorish behavior while there, as they would anywhere they travel to. So Islanders patience can surely, at times, bet real thin I have no doubts. Of course, not all visitors are like that.

And it doesn't always matter to others that one is a decent, respectful person if their patience and tolerance levels have been worn down and they want to see some sort of cessation of that or those who irritate them. I'm sure, as with an oyster, that most Islanders, be they native Hawaiians or not, that they coat that irritation to the point of making the situation into a pearl as it were. Still, if someone or a group of people is/are set on causing grief for another, even if that other hasn't done anything and, in fact, are a decent, respectful person, why, then little will stop them from causing one grief. And if the reason(s) for someone or a group of people to cause grief for others is of the large social/political arena (which usually really sets people off) then the individual that represents (to them) the root cause for their ire doesn't matter, no matter how far off the mark their assessment of that person is, they will go after that person or group of people just simply to vent their built up frustrations.

As I've kept up to some degree with what's going on in Hawaii I've long been aware of a, shall we say, A Free Hawaii for Free Hawaiians movement,a Hawaii independence movement that has grown over the decades and I very much appreciate the reasons that have caused this movement. I don't think they will be successful as, for one thing, corporate America through the US government, as it's done since the invasion of the Islands, would never allow for Hawaiian independence. But I appreciate Hawaiians' sentiments on this. Just as I've long appreciated the Native Americans on the mainland (much the same peoples known up in Canada as "First Nation" peoples) and their frustrations with the US government and the long ago invasion of their lands and marginalization (at best) of their peoples. I recall up here in the Northwest watching the news and reading the papers regarding the Salmon Wars in the late '60s through the '70s and thinking that after all that was done to their peoples can't America at least give them some greater latitude regarding the salmon?!

Anyway, my point is, I guess, is that although I've always eased through without problems everywhere I've lived so far in my 54 years ( I lived in Richland, California during the mid-'80s, one of the blackest sections of the East Bay and never had a problem, but I'd hear local news of probelms for others and it did give me the willies as I knew that if someone of some folks did decide that I just happen to fit the bill as an outlet for their frustrations that I could end up in bad shape no matter how much I worked to say,"hey! I'm a nice guy, despite being a white guy!"), I never take it for granted that just because I know I'm a nice, respectful guy that others anywhere will know the same or even care if they might happen to see me as representative and feel the need to take out some ire on someone and I just happen to be in their line of fire.

I don subscribe to the Kumbaya, "all you need is love", "everyone deserves a blue ribbon!" mindset as that doesn't square with reality. Example: no matter how nice and cool a guy I am, one who's never subscribed to what my government's been doing in the Middle East for far too long, I know that I can't take it for granted that MY knowing I'm a nice guy who's against my government's militaristic and corporate agenda in the ME if I decided to step foot in a Middle eastern country and think no one would see me only as a nice guy and leave me alone. I know that many would there. But I also know many would see me as representative of an armed aggressor and consider exacting their frustrations and anger with the American government and Western corporate entities on me because I'm right there to be got at. And no amount of saying I agree in great part with their point of view and that "hey, I'm a nice guy" will change their pent up rage.

Now, I don't see that more extreme scenario happening in Hawaii. But I am well aware that there are many there who do have real anger at those they see as "invaders" who come to claim and despoil their native lands. And I want to be very respectful of that, even embrace that concern and treat Hawaii with the respect and even reverence due it, a reverence I personally have always had since I can remember. That's actually just my personal thing. I'm very spiritual that way and see life in that mode. But how easily could I convey that to those already there who might see this humble white mainlander as just one more threat?

See what I'm getting at? It's not enough I KNOW that I'm a decent guy. The people who are most likely to feel threatened by first glance surface assessment need to know that. And my concern, especially after reading et123's post, is just how fast on the draw are the life-long residents and native Hawaiians? Is a "shoot first (so to speak) and ask questions later or never" more the norm and for folks wanting to move there the dreams of the Aloha Spirit is mere PR? Or can we move there and assimilate with real ease and not cause grief and have grief caused to us just because we dared to dream of the good life and the Aloha Spirit and decided to make that dream real?

I don't want to cause grief for others, anywhere, at any time. And I want the same in return, regardless of the fact I come from the mainland (although born on Oahu) and am white. I agree with you, race, color, whatever, doesn't matter to me. But it does to many others. And in a world that's getting more crowded and resources either decreasing and/or just plain becoming more expensive, frustrations building and tempers fraying over all kinds of issues, well, I think it doesn't pay to play at a Pollyanna mindset or one could end up hurt, either in spirit or physically or both. And given the small size of the Hawaiian environments, well, see what I'm getting at?

I do appreciate your thoughts. I would really like to hear from others as well. Be great to hear from native Hawaiians in particular. I knew some here, who were going to school, and we had a great time, enjoyed each others' company. But they never really gave me direct answers regarding the social climate there and the ease of moving there and assimilating. My son and I are very low key guy who like to blend in as best as possible and just scoot through without causing grief. I'm hoping when it comes time to make our way there that we won't have the same experience as et123 has posted about. I wish we had some Islander connections there. the ones I knew (actual Hawaiians) long ago moved away after finishing school so I'd lost connections with them. It's always nice to go somewhere in which one knows someone who can help ease into the scene. Oh well.

Anyway, thanks for replying. And thanks for bearing with my natural long windedness. I try to make things short, but alas...

(04-22-2014 07:15 AM)eleakai Wrote:  I really enjoyed reading your posts. You sure have made some interesting observations on your travels. I also think your plan sounds reasonable to move to Hawaii with as few belongings as possible and see how you like living here. I know quite a few people who moved to Hawaii and they love it and can't imagine ever leaving. Most local residents are not of Hawaiian ancestry, but are nevertheless Hawaiian at heart. I also think it's more important to appreciate, love and take care of the land.

Thanks, eleakai. I love diversity and other peoples and cultures and so look forward to living in Hawaii, my birth land. I've always felt "Hawaiian". It's something of a deeply spiritual nature. Not any kind of "religious" thing. Just a deep, abiding sense of connection to the Islands that comes from something deeper and more ancient than my merely having been born there. Has to do with, I guess, my appreciation that, as Canada's Red Green would say, "we're all in this together", i.e. really, we're all one Family of Mankind. Or, greater still, Family of Earth, as although an omnivore who certainly loves a tasty steak, fillet of whatever fish, or a juicy pork roast, nonetheless has great appreciation and reverence for all life on the planet and don't take from nature anymore than I have to. I guess I kinda see all that as part of how I've defined, from afar, the Aloha Spirit. I have a deep respect for Hawaii and for Hawaiians and their culture. I appreciate their concerns regarding the unceasing encroachment and despoilation of such a beautiful section of the world. I hope when my son and I get there that we can convey that and that despite being caucasian mainlanders that our life-long held love of all things Hawaii will come through and we can assimilate easily enough as I, at least, want to live the rest of my life there, and at 54 that's not that many years, average life spans for males being what they are.

Thanks for replying. And further thoughts on anything at all, now or any other time, that you can offer that could further inform us would be greatly appreciated. Aloha!
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04-24-2014, 07:29 AM
Post: #8
RE: Moving to Hawaii Regret
I personally think with your mindset you shouldn't have a problem assimilating in Hawaii. You know much more about the Islands than the average mainlander who is moving to Hawaii. Also, there are so many different types of people in Hawaii, different cultures, etc. that you can literally find everything you're looking for. So don't give up your dream and make your reality the way you envision it for you and your son.
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04-28-2014, 06:44 AM
Post: #9
RE: Moving to Hawaii Regret
Thanks very much for the good words of encouragement, eleakai. Now all we gotta do is get there, which is still a little ways off. Aloha!
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05-08-2014, 03:29 PM
Post: #10
RE: Moving to Hawaii Regret
I am saddened to read that your move wasn't as you had hoped. I hope that it gets better, and I pray blessings on you and your family. I hope when my hubby and our bulldogs get there, the experience is positive from day one. I have dreamed of this for too long, and my heart would be shattered to say I made every decision I have made thus far based around this move, and once I got there I hated it. I hope you find happiness there!!!
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